Poll: Given the many recent new additions/changes to Hex in the last weeks (Merry Melee modes, Cosmic Coins/Siege Sacks, Ladder changes), is your future outlook on Hex positive?

  • Fred wrote:

    Gregangel wrote:

    Fred wrote:

    Vroengard wrote:

    @Fred When's the next State of the Game article coming out?
    I submitted on Friday, so I guess I would expect it to be posted on Monday or on Tuesday.Spoiler, things aren't as bad as these forums make them to be.
    It is online. I read it carefully.The only reliable data are the ones about number of players interacting with the game.
    Most important ones are the number of players using the AH and a after that the number of players registered in tournaments.

    And sorry to say : these numbers are bad. With at least a 20 % decrease compared to the same month into set 9 which already show the worst records, thes numbers are very worrisome
    Increased ladder activity. Increased on-demand queues activity. Not all the numbers are good, but not all are bad either. You can't cherry pick just the thing you want to complain about and say that everything is bad.

    Didnt find enough time to read the article until now, but dunno how you can say that the numbers are not all bad... at least for my cup of tea they are horrible...


    Limited play
    In the current period, there were 2,626 (-58.5%/-38.0%) draft gauntlets, 4,290 (-65.0%/-42.1%) evo sealed gauntlets and 107 (-76.7%/-71.2%) sealed gauntlets completed.
    Austrian Kickstarter & Slacker Backer
    -=] Dont mess with the bull, you gonna get the horn [=-
  • Gregangel wrote:

    DeathRealm wrote:

    cainhu wrote:

    First of all, MTGA is not HEX greates rival, as at this point HEX is not relevant enough to be a rival to any somewhat successful xCG out there.
    I've meant that MTGA is the closest game to HEX (or vice versa) in terms of game mechanics, so it can get a big chunk of HEX's playerbase. I don't think any other card game released previously could have done such harm to HEX.
    MTGA is trying to shake up how f2p cards games work : they set up a competitive environment into a CCG model betEen mtgo model and HS model.
    This is the reason MTGA may be very appealing to Hex players even the ones who do not like f2p ccg games.

    But mtga have no impact on HEx. hex is burying itself
    The Jedi has turned into the dark side I see.

    Trouble times are to come. I must meditate to this.
  • Cernz wrote:

    Didnt find enough time to read the article until now, but dunno how you can say that the numbers are not all bad... at least for my cup of tea they are horrible...


    Limited play
    In the current period, there were 2,626 (-58.5%/-38.0%) draft gauntlets, 4,290 (-65.0%/-42.1%) evo sealed gauntlets and 107 (-76.7%/-71.2%) sealed gauntlets completed.

    Yes, those numbers are bad. I never said that none of the numbers looked bad. However, looking at Merry Melee, we have one of two situations:

    1) People who left the limited queues played Merry Melee instead, and they played it more than they would have limited. Increased player activity. This is not bad.
    -- OR --
    2) People who played Merry Melee probably wouldn't have played limited instead, so the numbers for limited would have been equally bad without Merry Melee. That means people who played Merry Melee decided to play Hex instead of not playing Hex. Increased player base. This is not bad.

    Or it could be a mix of both. Either way, it is not all bad. We couldn't expect Hex to flip everything on a dime instantly and go from the worst month in the history of Hex to the best one. But progress is being made in that people are playing more Hex than they used to, even if they're not playing the format that you care about.
  • Fred wrote:

    Cernz wrote:

    Didnt find enough time to read the article until now, but dunno how you can say that the numbers are not all bad... at least for my cup of tea they are horrible...


    Limited play
    In the current period, there were 2,626 (-58.5%/-38.0%) draft gauntlets, 4,290 (-65.0%/-42.1%) evo sealed gauntlets and 107 (-76.7%/-71.2%) sealed gauntlets completed.
    Yes, those numbers are bad. I never said that none of the numbers looked bad. However, looking at Merry Melee, we have one of two situations:

    1) People who left the limited queues played Merry Melee instead, and they played it more than they would have limited. Increased player activity. This is not bad.
    -- OR --
    2) People who played Merry Melee probably wouldn't have played limited instead, so the numbers for limited would have been equally bad without Merry Melee. That means people who played Merry Melee decided to play Hex instead of not playing Hex. Increased player base. This is not bad.

    Or it could be a mix of both. Either way, it is not all bad. We couldn't expect Hex to flip everything on a dime instantly and go from the worst month in the history of Hex to the best one. But progress is being made in that people are playing more Hex than they used to, even if they're not playing the format that you care about.
    ya thats true, but - that confirms the fact that the playerbase is too small for the amount of formats they offer - which is bad overall.
    Austrian Kickstarter & Slacker Backer
    -=] Dont mess with the bull, you gonna get the horn [=-
  • Cernz wrote:

    Fred wrote:

    Cernz wrote:

    Didnt find enough time to read the article until now, but dunno how you can say that the numbers are not all bad... at least for my cup of tea they are horrible...


    Limited play
    In the current period, there were 2,626 (-58.5%/-38.0%) draft gauntlets, 4,290 (-65.0%/-42.1%) evo sealed gauntlets and 107 (-76.7%/-71.2%) sealed gauntlets completed.
    Yes, those numbers are bad. I never said that none of the numbers looked bad. However, looking at Merry Melee, we have one of two situations:
    1) People who left the limited queues played Merry Melee instead, and they played it more than they would have limited. Increased player activity. This is not bad.
    -- OR --
    2) People who played Merry Melee probably wouldn't have played limited instead, so the numbers for limited would have been equally bad without Merry Melee. That means people who played Merry Melee decided to play Hex instead of not playing Hex. Increased player base. This is not bad.

    Or it could be a mix of both. Either way, it is not all bad. We couldn't expect Hex to flip everything on a dime instantly and go from the worst month in the history of Hex to the best one. But progress is being made in that people are playing more Hex than they used to, even if they're not playing the format that you care about.
    ya thats true, but - that confirms the fact that the playerbase is too small for the amount of formats they offer - which is bad overall.
    This was discussed many many times. Unfortunately a lot of people said : If you make the formats people will come. Formats were added but not so sure sooo many new players joined

    The increase in negativity have made people leave the game and sell their things because they are afraid

    See it like a stock market. When things go down people panic and sell.

    I play more hex then I used too. Actually have not enough time for everything I want to play in this game which means what they added is actually working ( for me )
  • Give me rewarding limited play that is not top heavy over MM any day of the week. Would prefer kismet drafts over it too. I find it hard to believe people are forgoing limited for MM. Constructed players and other non limited players probably played MM and tje time investment seems really small. Regardless the luster of MM seems to have already started to fade.
  • Give me sustainable, lightly rewarded PvE content and I'm happy to keep running with this. But no, Siege had to be worked over to cater to the competitive crowd, which already gets about 90% of the content.


    Sukebe wrote:

    That said, I have no doubt that Cory and the developers make every decision with the best intentions. they are still human (no matter how much people on this forum like to dehumanize them) and so they make mistakes.
    There's a difference between making a mistake and doing what HXE did.

    Siege's release was a mess. The format was unbalanced, the AI was busted, and lots of things weren't working as intended. That's a mistake. That just needs finetuning. But what we got instead of finetuning was mode-exclusive, untradeable rewards. That's doubling down on a mistake, and not something that comes from a place of goodwill or 'best intentions'. That's just disrespectful to your players.
  • Fred wrote:

    1) People who left the limited queues played Merry Melee instead, and they played it more than they would have limited. Increased player activity. This is not bad.
    Are you just looking at number of games, or are you taking into account different amounts of time spent due to formats being different?

    For example, if someone goes from spending 4 hours total on 5 games of Limited to 3 hours total on 10 games of MM, would you consider that an increase or decrease in activity?
  • I’d agree that just that won’t work

    big update to the new player experience
    - Better tutorial explaining the game and functions
    - Locking some game modes and unlocking them as you gain account leveling ( see below )
    - Using the account leveling system for better progression the first 10 levels helping new players acquire account bound decks and specific account bound card bundles to help build and explain how things go
    - Better visual of the account leveling system popping and showing progression each time ( like the stars of ladder )
    - By binding the locking system and the leveling system you could add tutorial to certain part of the game like when the player gets its firs evo, the tutorial of evo should start and explain how to do things the first time.

    Of course all tutorial could be turn off by going Into the settings but I think it would mostly benefit people

    Then bang. Marketing

    But you know , this takes time and man power. And money which at this point is very limited

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Portensio ().

  • Portensio wrote:

    And money which at this point is very limited
    To be fair, there were a ton of thigns they could have monetized like

    -AA champions
    -Campaign comsetics
    -AA Shards
    and I'm sure there are others too. People have often said "I'd pay for that". You know what would be super amazing to know but we never will? How many Store Battleboards have been sold.
  • Vroengard wrote:

    Portensio wrote:

    And money which at this point is very limited
    To be fair, there were a ton of thigns they could have monetized like
    -AA champions
    -Campaign comsetics
    -AA Shards
    and I'm sure there are others too. People have often said "I'd pay for that". You know what would be super amazing to know but we never will? How many Store Battleboards have been sold.
    It’s a population problem

    If you are a true f2p game , and have 100k players if we take 10% of players paying for cosmetics then we have 10k sold cosmetics

    When you have 5k players , and 10% of players pay , you just sold 500 boards.

    I believe cosmetics are better suited for bigger and more f2p game compared to something like hex , where their income comes from the current model which makes less people play the game.

    As a pure example , mtga will have a lot more players then mtgo simply because of its model. They will eventually put cosmetics as those that are f2p might be interested in cosmetics stuff since anyways they don’t spend on the fame

    If you want to play hex you need to put money in or love grinding pve which contradicts the fact that people want to play pvp

    Better put rewards throug playing the game like coins and sacks. I’m not saying siege is great or anything but still think it’s implementstion was ok- good.

    I still think cosmic coins could be used in a more general use. There is too much plat in the system and no sink

    My 2 cents
  • Portensio wrote:

    The Jedi has turned into the dark side I see.

    Trouble times are to come. I must meditate to this.

    The sad thing is I'd prefere to quench my thirst of draft on Hex and give them my money.
    But today the state of the game does no more allow it with reasonable condition. Instead I can play silly janky, low effort engeniered format I dont care at all...

    But in the mean time I was able to draft 28 times during the last 7 week for 400plat (gems wathever). Never wait more than 30s in queue to get a match.
    And also as I stoped playing Magic years ago I was able to draft with 9 sets completly new to me. It is like christmass for me.

    So yeah, it is sad really. It would have been completly silly to not make the switch considering my player profil.

    The post was edited 4 times, last by Gregangel ().

  • Mach wrote:

    Fred wrote:

    1) People who left the limited queues played Merry Melee instead, and they played it more than they would have limited. Increased player activity. This is not bad.
    Are you just looking at number of games, or are you taking into account different amounts of time spent due to formats being different?
    For example, if someone goes from spending 4 hours total on 5 games of Limited to 3 hours total on 10 games of MM, would you consider that an increase or decrease in activity?

    I can't look at data I don't have. "Time spent in game" is one such variable I can't comment on.
  • I'm a very active limited player.. and while Merry Melee was running I did notice a sharp decline in the frequency of draft matchs.

    As a result rather than sit in 2-0 que for hours I played a lot of Merry Melee instead of actively trying to finish my draft pod to start another. I'm sure many limited players did similar - most of the modes were very limited (ish) in game play and style and were firing off at a very good rate. Of note - I played 0 matchs of the dingler format.

    As far as the injection of platinum to the economy I think this is a positive thing overall. Technically speaking every 14 players in an event cover the "cost" of the 4-0 prize. The prize in turn prompts players to spend platium a little more liberally... maybe finishing a set of wells, or getting those chase rares for their immortal deck they want to play gauntlets with. It also provides a direct payout for prizing - as any of us who have been fortunate enough to top 4 a cash event know is a net positive.
    So I think 2 fold - the extra platinum being put into the economy should both help stimulate AH or trade chat sales, in addition to helping more people play in more events.
    Activity is certainly down - and I hope it turns around.

    Maybe we would have seen something similar during DoW had kismet not arived - people were very vocal about hating the candle/verdict limited meta.

    It's a real shame new players may have to read these forums.. especially the messages of many people who adamantly swear to want to see the game grow and succeed. Its a sad state of affairs indeed.

    Looking forward to some set 10 news and see where things are headed.. I'll likely be waiting in the draft que.

    Cheers
  • Fred wrote:

    Mach wrote:

    Fred wrote:

    1) People who left the limited queues played Merry Melee instead, and they played it more than they would have limited. Increased player activity. This is not bad.
    Are you just looking at number of games, or are you taking into account different amounts of time spent due to formats being different?For example, if someone goes from spending 4 hours total on 5 games of Limited to 3 hours total on 10 games of MM, would you consider that an increase or decrease in activity?
    I can't look at data I don't have. "Time spent in game" is one such variable I can't comment on.
    Then don't make comparisons or draw conclusions which would require such data to be meaningful.
  • Mach wrote:

    Fred wrote:

    Mach wrote:

    Fred wrote:

    1) People who left the limited queues played Merry Melee instead, and they played it more than they would have limited. Increased player activity. This is not bad.
    Are you just looking at number of games, or are you taking into account different amounts of time spent due to formats being different?For example, if someone goes from spending 4 hours total on 5 games of Limited to 3 hours total on 10 games of MM, would you consider that an increase or decrease in activity?
    I can't look at data I don't have. "Time spent in game" is one such variable I can't comment on.
    Then don't make comparisons or draw conclusions which would require such data to be meaningful.
    I was curious, so I went ahead and looked at the replay tool, which shows how long each game lasts. I took the first 60 games for each formats, and while it's not a significant sample size, nothing indicates that this sample is not representative of typical matches.

    Draft games lasted an average of 9 minutes and 4 seconds. Since Draft is Bo3, a match (about 2 and a half games on average) would last 22 minutes and 39 seconds.
    Ladder games lasted an average of 9 minutes and 45 seconds. Since Ladder is Bo3, a match (about 2 and a half games on average) would last 24 minutes and 23 seconds.
    Evo Sealed games lasted an average of 9 minutes and 57 seconds.
    R.O.I.D. games lasted an average of 10 minutes and 53 seconds.

    Unfortunately, I can't go back in time to see how long the other Merry Melee formats lasted on average, so we have to deal with the data that we have.

    Merry Melee games, at least in this format, last roughly the same time, if not longer, than games of other formats. The only significant factor is whether a match is best-of-1 or best-of-3.

    Using these gross (but reasonable) approximations, limited queues would have lost a total of about 30,000 hours of play time, while Merry Melee was played for about 49,300 hours, a net gain of 19,000 hours of game play. If we take the hypothesis that R.O.I.D. is by far the slowest format of all (which I would disagree with, but let's do it for the sake of conversation), and claim that Merry Melee matches, across all the other formats, actually only lated 7 minutes on average (a reduction of 35%), Merry Melee play time would still come up ahead by 1500 hours.